Bryan McAnulty [00:00:00]:

Welcome to the creator's adventure where we interview creators from around the world hearing their stories about growing a business. Appearing on podcasts is a great way to grow your brand, and today's guest is gonna show you how to do it. Hey, everyone. I'm Brian McAnulty, the founder of Heights Platform. Let's get into it. Hey, everyone. We're here today with Misha Zvegansov, The founder of the influence army, and he is the host of the Table Rush talk show. He loves to share his insights, strategies, and tactics so so that you can use your customer stories to increase your traffic, leads, sales, and conversions.

Bryan McAnulty [00:00:40]:

He is, obsession with the Collecting customer stories and testimonials has given him the nickname, the testimonial guy. Misha, welcome to the show.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:00:51]:

Thank you. It's so good to be here. I'm so excited, Brian.

Bryan McAnulty [00:00:54]:

Awesome. So my first question for you today is, what would you say is the biggest thing either that you did or you are doing that has helped you to achieve the freedom to do what you enjoy?

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:01:06]:

That, my friend, is a great, great question, and, I will the the biggest thing that I did bar none was to quit my career As a, mortgage loan officer after 15, 20 years, I quit my sales career. 15 years of it was in, I was a mortgage loan officer and, had a ton of success. Was was very good at it, very gifted at it, was great at systemizing the processes to bring new Customers in and then to help them get their loans and do all those things and then and then turn those existing, you know, loan getters into getting their next loans with me is what I would say. Right? And and I was really good at At Finding Niches, mining data to find people that I could help. Right? And then I would do telemarketing campaigns For the, take to get them, I would do flyer campaigns to bring those customers in. I just was really good I had sifted through that data, and I paid a lot of money to be in these crazy databases where you could sort and find, You know, all these parameters, and I loved it. And I loved serving people and helping them get their loans and and doing all this. And then literally overnight, All of the things that I was gifted at in home loans became painful, due to there was some divorce in there.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:02:39]:

There was, Parents died in there, you know, another failed relationship. Just this existential crisis of How am I serving the world even? And, yeah. So I I hit this point in about 2013 15th maybe 13, 14, 15. The timeline is a little fuzzy, but, where it became painful, And I stayed in the business 2 years too long. Like I said, overnight, everything became painful. When I used to sit in sales meetings, I was the type of person that was like, hey. You're either here To help, to serve, to be energetic, to be a part of, or don't waste our time. Right? And then overnight, I became the cynical one.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:03:28]:

I became the The problem at the sales meeting, shall we say. And I really saw that and yeah. And I'll try and cut to the chase here, but, I was, like, talking to the universe saying, you know, universe, give me my next career so I can quit. Give me my next career so I can quit. And so I was praying for that and talking to the universe, talking to god, say it however you want. Right? Like, how can I serve? Give me the next thing. And, that next thing was not being presented, and, I needed to quit To find the next thing. And so when I finally had that epiphany of, like, the leap I have to make is to walk away.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:04:12]:

And, I'll never forget the day I did it. I I went into my boss, and I was like, you know, I'm done. I quit. And his reaction was, We'll match whatever offer you have out there. And I was like, no. You don't understand. I'm quitting business. And, and, he actually said to me, oh my god.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:04:31]:

I'm so jealous. I wish I could do that too. But, anyway so I I it was kind of a long answer, but, I think quitting that that painful situation to make space for the new next good This is the biggest thing. Does that answer that question?

Bryan McAnulty [00:04:47]:

Yeah. No. That's that's great advice, I think, because, you had me drawn in there. I was wondering about what what's gonna happen? How did How did he find it then? And I think you're right, though. Most often, the way way to make that happen is is you have to put in some effort and sometimes Do something pretty drastic in order to really make that change for yourself. So I like that.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:05:10]:

Yeah. Yeah. I'll even follow-up. You know, what it turned out was was that I needed to I had 2 tween boys at the time. So what what the universe really wanted me to do, I had money in the bank, and so I was in a space of my money pile needs to keep getting bigger and bigger and bigger, and I was comparing myself to everybody in their imaginary money piles or whatever and trying to do the right thing and save for retirement and all this stuff. And and really what it came down to was, I was a divorced single dad, and, I needed to quit my job and really focus on my boys and get them through, you know, grade school, through high school, and prioritize that number 1. Like, make them their lunches, get them to swimming, get them to school, help them get their homework done. And, literally, That became my job and one of the best things that I ever did.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:06:07]:

Right? And I have my one son, Waylon, who's 20 now. But at the time, he would literally open the door from his bedroom and, like, look out into the living room and see if I was there, And he'd say I was there, and he'd be like, okay. Everything's good. Right? So my job was literally just to be there for those boys. But, anyway.

Bryan McAnulty [00:06:31]:

Yeah. No. That's great. I think, like, it's it's really incredible when you can find something that that you enjoy and feel purpose in doing because then the the money doesn't matter anymore almost. Like, of course, Everybody needs some amount of money to to survive, provide for their family, and everything. But it's easy to, like, fall into these, These traps of, like, how you describe, like, oh, well, how how's my money pile compared to his money pile or whatever, where, Like, I think the ideal, like, life and, like, what I try to focus on and aspire to is freedom over The money and realizing that, like, the freedom is what I always wanted anyway, and that's why most people want money is because they believe that equals freedom, but it It doesn't necessarily. And so if you can get yourself to a point where, like, you feel that purpose and and everything without, like, having all the money in the world yet, then, like, you did it, like, in my mind. Right? So, like, I feel grateful that, like, I'm able to wake up and realize, like, the thing I would be doing today is the same as what I would be doing if I had all the money in the world.

Bryan McAnulty [00:07:44]:

So I I think it's it's really worth, like, really focusing on and and taking, like, these drastic actions like you did if that means you can get closer to whatever that thing is for you. So you started in, like, old school sales and and direct sales and all that, not in the online world. How do you kinda transition from that to podcast and digital marketing? And what would you say are, like, some fundamental skills that maybe You learned, in sales that you brought into today's business.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:08:18]:

I love that. That is such a great question. So, You know, I I was raising those 2 boys of mine and and, getting them through high school and and all this fun stuff. Right? In the back of my mind, and keep in mind, I'm always thinking about how can I serve? How can I serve? Like, I'm literally it's my mantra. I try and be in that mindset of, You know, how can I serve the world? What can I bring to the table? And, you know, being a human, being egotistical, that's a delicate balance. Sometimes I can fool myself. I I can think like, yes. I'm helping, but, really, it's my I'm chasing a shiny object.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:08:53]:

But, Anyway, sorry to go down that rabbit hole. I always knew that as soon as my kids got through high school and and out of the house, like, New entrepreneurial endeavors would come. Right? And, sure enough, you know, my 1 son Gets out of high school, moves out. My other son is a senior, and and, you know, I'm hurtling towards the empty nest. And He's got his girlfriend. He's got his job. He's doing great at school. Like, he almost needs no no support for me.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:09:25]:

And, I was like, alright. I I can see the new entrepreneurial opportunities starting to pop up. And, You know, I stumbled across Russell Brunson. If you know Russell Brunson being in the online space, I'm sure you know about Russell Brunson. Right? And, yeah. And so in sales, I was very great at the systems, And we would have a sales funnel. Right? And so where is somebody in that sales process? Right? Are they a lead? Have I had contact with them? You know, have I presented my offer? You know, how many follow ups have I done? Right? That systemizing that whole process, And, I love that. That's one of the things that are my gifts.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:10:12]:

Right? And so I was riding on a train with someone by coincidence. I'm like, what do you do? And, he goes, well, I write copy for, you know, for for, for sales funnels or whatever. And I'm like, A sales funnel? What are you talking about? And he goes, well, you know, because I write copy for, Eckhart Toll, And Eckhart Tolle is about to do this big launch, and this is how it works. And I was, like, I was captivated, and and, I just that's how I ended. I just I ended up in the the guy sorry. I got distracted. I was like, how long do I wanna drag the story out? I'll try to cut to the chase. I I have this habit of really telling long stories, and so I try to be cognizant of shorten them down.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:10:57]:

But I was on the train with this guy for 2 hours, and I'm just peppering him. And I'm like, I've gotta learn more. And After the event was done, we were on the train back for another 2 hours, and I was like, oh my gosh. I've got him for another 2 hours. I have a captive audience. He's trapped. Right? And he said, hey. Yeah.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:11:15]:

He goes, this is, I don't know, 3, 4, 5 years ago, whatever it is, 5 years ago by now. He goes, get Russell Brunson's .com secrets, I guess, I'd get Jeff Walker's launch. And, and so, of course, I got those books, and then I was immediately in Russell Brunson's funnels, and he's the master at funnels and painting that picture. And so, I got sucked in. And then, the things that to directly answer your question, some of the skill sets That trend that I bring from old school sales into that digital online marketing space. So and how did I get into podcasting and all that? So at the time in Russell Brunson's high end coaching, it's called the 2 CCX. I'm still in it. You know, he's got higher levels of coaching.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:12:09]:

He's got his, you know, inner circle and then his, Whatever category Kings Atlas and all that. But, anyway, in the two c c x, it's like, hey. You gotta pick a platform to start getting your message out there. You know, pick YouTube, podcasting, or, blogging. And I picked podcasting, because I love all the tech, all the toys. You can see them all around. Excuse me. So what immediately I have been able to bring is in sales when I was doing sales, and I've done a1000000, Literally a 1000000 telemarketing phone calls.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:12:49]:

Right? I've gone door to door. I've walked door to door. I've walked business to business. And and Back in the day, we used to listen to Zig Ziglar and Brian Tracy and all these kinds of of salespeople. And I would literally have a cassette tape, And I would put it in an old Walkman. Anybody listening knows what a Walkman is. Right? Or then it was CDs, and I would walk to work, and I would have these tapes. What they would tell you was smile when you're talking on the phone.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:13:19]:

Smile. Right? And so I used to have, a smile stick, like a smile selfie stick back in the in the late nineties, so it would remind me to smile. So whenever I get on the phone, Whenever I get on a podcast with someone like you, whenever I go to a networking event, I smile habitually. Right? And that makes us More inviting. It makes us more, the synopsis. Like, there's all these studies out there. So I naturally, when people meet me or see me on the podcast, they go, oh my god. You have amazing energy.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:13:55]:

I'm like, yeah. I I habitually smile. I roll my shoulders back. Right? Sit up straight. So these are all things in sales, like, Sit up straight. Smile. Roll your shoulders back. And then, you know, I talked a little bit about prayer, talking to god, the universe, call it what you will, about being of And and about how I can be of service.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:14:18]:

So whenever I'm about to jump on a podcast or or create something, I'm like, alright, god or universe. How can I be of service? What can I bring to the table? Right. And and when you're doing telemarketing sales, Initially, it can be a grind. It can be heavy. And so you really have to figure out, like, I'm here to serve, and so every no is an opportunity opportunity for me to find that person to serve. Does that make yet sense to get to the test?

Bryan McAnulty [00:14:51]:

Yeah. 100%. I mean, I can relate to that even having never done, like, the telemarketing kind of thing It's like even just in, like, the content that I'm creating. First of all, the smiling thing, I think, is important. And for me, I think that's something like I really have to, like, consciously work towards. Some people are more naturally maybe better at that than others, but I think it's important to, like, to practice that if you're not. Because I remember in, like, elementary school, my teachers would say like, oh, Brian, you have, like, the best poker face. No one has any idea what you're think.

Bryan McAnulty [00:15:22]:

And, like, I I do feel that that that is that is a little bit true of naturally just, like, not really revealing as much in my expression, which I should because I agree, like, what What you're saying, like, it helps the energy of the whole thing and people feel more comfortable to to talk around you and everything. And and even on a phone call, when they don't see it, It comes through. And so that's the one point, but then the 2nd point about, like, remembering the serve and everything, like, I didn't have this natural feeling that, like, I wanna be popular on social media. I want people to know who I am. Like, I actually rather rather not than just do my thing. But I realized, like, the reason that I'm doing something like this podcast and, like, you just interview interviewed me on your podcast was that I care more about getting my message out there to help people and make that impact on people that I know I can provide that value than I do of, like, not caring to be popular on social media. And so realizing that that's the reason and and focusing in on that.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:16:25]:

Yeah. I love that. So good. It's interesting. I was on a podcast interview, The Ecom X Factor, and, you know, they're all about ecom products. And And he says he literally said to me, well, what about us introverts? Right? Because he's like, you're so outgoing. And I'm like, well, That's a great, great question. And I think, 1, the thing to remember in all this is not to try to be somebody who are not.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:16:54]:

Right? It's like bring we're just trying to bring forth the best version of who we are in that moment. Right? So If you're an introvert and you'd like to hide out in a hoodie, show up on the podcast in your hoodie, but just smile. You know what I mean? It's like you you don't need to be anybody you're not, and I think what happens is as we embrace who we are more, those people who grab it who who who resonate with us will gravitate towards us. Right? And that's one of the great things about the Internet right now. And I sound naive saying this, but it's like, hey. We have access to 8,000,000,000 people. So be you, someone's gonna find you. Right? Yeah.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:17:41]:

But any yeah. But I'll also say, I wanna tell a quick story unless you had another question because I have a quick story.

Bryan McAnulty [00:17:49]:

Go ahead. Go ahead.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:17:50]:

Yeah. Yeah. So when I was a kid, I was painfully, painfully, painfully shy. And, like, if I had to get up in front of class to speak, I would cry. I couldn't do it. And I even had a teacher one time, god bless them, but they were like, he should come up and answer the question. And they're like, oh, you're probably gonna cry and La la la and just humiliated me. Right? And and sure enough, I got up there and I cried, and it just Just you know, that that moment seared in my head.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:18:22]:

It's probably one of the reasons that I was like, I'm gonna be in sales and do great, but, I think with practice and diligence and practicing these these tricks of smiling and doing these things we can We talked about we can be outgoing in our own way. Does does that make sense kinda?

Bryan McAnulty [00:18:43]:

Yeah. I I think it's true, And and I relate to that as well. I'm I'm an introvert. I was always shy and stuff in school. And the The kind of analogy I like to compare it with, I would say, is I realized for myself the one thing that I didn't feel nervous with was I was in a band in high school, and I have no problem playing guitar in front of hundreds of people. I I didn't feel nervous really about that, but, like, to to give a speech in front of the class or something like that, yeah, totally totally nervous about that. And I realized it's because, like, when I'm when I'm performing and, like, playing the guitar, like, I'm just doing my thing. Like, that's the that's the thing that I enjoy.

Bryan McAnulty [00:19:25]:

I'm just doing it. I'm not thinking or caring about what people think of me in that moment. And I think that's that's kind of The way that it is, like, if you can practice practice going through and and to telemarketing or or talking in front of people, whatever it is, You can get to the point that you're so comfortable with it that you just feel like, oh, I'm just being me. I'm just doing my thing rather than feeling the potential judgment or uncertainty and kinda having, like, the shyness take over.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:19:56]:

Yeah. I love that. That's a a a great way to I met, I'll give anybody else listening a a little tip too that I learned from McCall Jones. If you know who McCall Jones is, but she's got this program, She calls it charisma hacking. But she says, hey. You know, whenever you're gonna go on a podcast or you're gonna go speak in public or do any of these things, She says find that 7 moment that 7 excitement level moment, in your life, and then talk it through Before you jump on the podcast, before you go on stage, and and so, like, you know, a 7 moment might be that, Hey. I'm I'm sending out a new round of invites to go speak on podcasts. I sent 1 sent 1 to Brian McNulty, and, he says yes.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:20:48]:

Right? And I'm like, yeah. My new my new I knew pitch worked. Right? Like, that's a 7th moment. And so if I'm nervous before I'm gonna jump on Another show I can be, like I can literally say, oh my gosh. I was building up this script and how I wanna serve, and I was gonna start sending out emails. And I was so nervous, And I came up with this new email, and I sent it out. I sent it to Brian. And, oh my god, he said yes.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:21:17]:

Right? Like, show up with that kind of energy versus, like, The overhypy energy, you know, like, the 10. And so I love that idea, and I think that was a great tip that I heard. So I just Yeah. I like that. Share that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Bryan McAnulty [00:21:32]:

Yeah. So for those listening who are entrepreneurs and they've heard like, okay. Well, Podcasting can be a a way of promoting my business. And, specifically, like, let's say, whether you have a podcast or not, being a guest on other people's podcasts. I think this is something that either people maybe underestimate how powerful it can be to do that Or even if they know, they don't know how to get started with that. So I wanna talk about that a little bit because So we just I was just on your show right now. I'm gonna be on another podcast later today, But I'm kinda new to this myself. And I found that, like, yeah, I have this company.

Bryan McAnulty [00:22:16]:

We've got thousands of customers. We've been around for a while, but I haven't really been on podcast. I haven't really done that kind of thing, so people don't know about me. And so, I'm still kinda starting from scratch in a way even though, like, I'm an established business. And so I I think it takes effort, even if you've been doing this for a while just to kinda get started. So I guess, what what would you tell somebody who is maybe in a position like myself where maybe they've done a few podcasts already Or maybe they're brand new to this, and they wanna figure out, like, well, how can I be a guest on somebody's podcast if nobody really knows who I am yet?

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:22:52]:

Yeah. It's such a great, great, great question. You know, I think we all have stories to tell. Right? And and I think when you interviewed me, we talked a little bit about or when I interviewed you, you referenced Imposter syndrome. Right? And and with what you do and with your Heights platform and The people that you help, you know, create their courses, their membership, all that, really what the holdup is is Putting yourself out there. The launch the launch of the idea. Putting it out there. Right? We're trying to get it shiny enough.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:23:33]:

We're trying to get it, You know, perfect, and we wanna market it the perfect way, and we wanna know all this before we we go to market. Right? And, I think it's a little bit the same with with with with going on a podcast or shall we say. Right? So one thing you can do let's see. Where do I wanna go with this? So I'm a systems guy. Right. And so I like to to systemize everything and make it easy. Right? So Rule number so you could decide right now. I'm gonna go on a podcast tour, and I don't know what I'm gonna say yet.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:24:21]:

Well, great. You probably have an idea of the audience you wanna speak to, so you could start building that list of podcasts that you wanna speak on. Right. You can start doing that sort of fundamental work. Right? At the same time as you start building out that list of podcasts that you wanna speak on, the next thing you could do is go, okay. I know I've got stories to tell. So people are like, what do I say? When do I say it? What am I gonna talk about? Right. I think that's another concern that we have when we're gonna go on podcast.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:24:53]:

Right? So I have got what's called my, My story bank, my story bank framework. I can't remember the name of it what it is right now, which is incredible pressure. But, basically, it's Start collecting your stories that you can pull from when you're asked questions. Right? So I have 4 story arcs to my life. There's the recovery lens. So I got Clean and sober at a super young age, 17, and I've been sober my whole life. And and, I have that lens To pull from. Right? And I have stories.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:25:34]:

Like, my speaking of being of service comes from From that recovery lens. Right? Like, part of getting sober and clean is You gotta shift your mindset out of being selfish to serve, right, for example. Then I've got my, Sort of the success years. Right? My mortgage success years. I was making ton of money. I was married, grew my kids, like, all this sort of stuff. Right. Like, I've got all these great stories to tell, you know, my Zig Ziglar experiences, all this stuff.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:26:10]:

And I've got my sorta failure Flame out existential divorce crash. And now my other story arc is my, You know, the digital marketing influence army where I am. Right? So you figure out what those 4 key story arcs in your life, and then you start Inventorying the stories within them. Does that make sense? Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. Useful? Yeah. Yeah.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:26:38]:

Cool. Cool. And so then within those stories, we're looking for those, our own stories, Our customer success stories, right, and then our sort of mentor inspirational moment stories. So we're looking for those 3 things. And what I tell my students is don't prejudge those stories. Just write them down. Doesn't mean you have to use them to start listing out your stories. Right? So you get your your 3 or 4 or 5 story arcs of your life.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:27:12]:

And within each of those story arcs, what are your personal stories? What are your customer stories, if any? Or it could be, You know, mom stories, cousin stories, any any success point stories. Right? And then Those those inspirational mentor stories or or, like, you're walking down the street and you meet somebody and they say something to you, and it Changes the course of your life. Right?

Bryan McAnulty [00:27:39]:

Yeah. And

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:27:39]:

then all you need to

Bryan McAnulty [00:27:40]:

do is I wanna I wanna kinda interject here quick just to say that I think this is important because Even after you get on, like, the show, like, the they booked you and they said, like, okay. We're we're gonna have it. It's still important to know all that, and you might think to yourself, like, I know, like, I know what my life is. Like, what do you mean? Why do I have to write this kind of thing down? But they're like, from my limited experience being on A few podcasts here and there. I've noticed that, like, it's really important to really get honed in on those stories that you have that you wanna tell. Because the person interviewing you, they might be a great interviewer, but still, like, they don't know the right way to ask the question necessarily to get that story out of you. And so you don't wanna also have to rely on the person you're talking to or person interviewing you being the best interviewer in the world to have done the most research and know everything and happen to get the exact right wording to get that answer out of you. You wanna have that that story kinda in your mind already that they're able to edge ask that question, and you can make the connection and say, this this is the thing I'm gonna talk about here.

Bryan McAnulty [00:28:46]:

Here's this story because this is what it all connects to, and you can speak a lot more clearly and and provide some engaging value that way.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:28:55]:

Absolutely. And, subconsciously, I believe and I'm sure there are studies on it, but I've just found it to be true. Subconsciously, our mind is has that inventory of stories and is looking for chances to pull them out and naturally gives us the opportune we find the segue for the interviewer. Right? It's like, oh, the story is growing. It just comes up. Right? And, yeah, and I even think, And when we're when I'm listing those stories, I just write down a word or a phrase. You don't have to pencil out the whole thing. You can, but it's just like good to remember key moments.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:29:33]:

Right? And what's what's the phrase or the word that can spark that memory? Right?

Bryan McAnulty [00:29:39]:

Yeah. Yeah. And I think I think probably everyone here has realized, like, someone that they've watched on a podcast or a show or something Be interviewed, and there's times when, like, either they themselves, their team, their their PR agent, whatever, It's kinda told them to, like, hey. This is, well, this is what we wanna talk about. And they try to, like, turn it into into that. Right? And so sometimes maybe that could be a bad thing if if they're really they're They're just trying to talk about their agenda, and they don't wanna, like, go with the flow of everything. But at the same time, it's that, like, they they have this inventory in their in their mind and in their head of ready to go of how can they relate these different pieces to the message they wanna share with the world.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:30:21]:

Yeah. Absolutely. And then, you know, the practice comes in, and I spoke to it earlier, and I I need work on it. It's like, how do I shorten or lengthen the story? Right? We've got our 32nd version, our 3 minute. You know?

Bryan McAnulty [00:30:34]:

Yeah.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:30:34]:

5 minute.

Bryan McAnulty [00:30:35]:

No. Well, I I completely agree. I have to work on that as well because, yeah, you start telling it, and then you're like, Oh, I remember my whole life now, and then you wanna tell about all of it. Right? But, so, like, it it's funny to think about that. It does really take practice to to tell your own story in the the most engaging and, like, concise way possible.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:30:55]:

Yeah. Absolutely. And and you know what? I speak a lot with my hands. Right? And and and if you watch me whenever I speak, I speak a lot with my hands and and Where am I going with this? I I just I just remembered, like, be you. Right? Like, we wanna be ourselves. If you speak a lot with your hands, use your hands, And don't let other people, dissuade you from being who you are. Right? So some people will say, Misha, you You use your hands too much when you speak. Right? Like, I'm doing it right now.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:31:28]:

And now everyone might be paying attention to that, which is amazing, but People are drawn to that too. So the reason I'm telling you that story is because I contend to draw on with my stories, but people have given me feedback and said, I love when you just go on with your story. That's what I love about you. Right? And so, again, as we spoke to earlier, it's finding that person that resonates with us. Right? And we don't need to be all things to all people. So anyone listening or watching, like, don't freak out if you think your stories are too long. It's okay. Yeah.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:32:07]:

That was that

Bryan McAnulty [00:32:07]:

was my point there. Just the the effort moving forward and practicing at it, you'll get better. But, yeah, I think that's important to note too. Like, you don't have to be this Perfect version of what everybody maybe says. You're allowed to certain imperfections about yourself or what people consider to be imperfections are actually, like, that's what makes you you. Okay. So how about, like, now, like, we get what we should do to prepare. How do we actually reach out to, like a podcast to to get them to accept us.

Bryan McAnulty [00:32:36]:

Because I know in in this situation, actually, you reached out to us. We don't accept that many The question guest, we usually just go and say like, hey. Do you wanna be on the show? And we kinda, like, have it set. So you convinced us. I'm curious if you can share a little bit of, like, your your template or framework of how somebody can use that to approach podcast to be on there.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:32:57]:

Yeah. That's such a such a great question, and, I do have a framework for it. I, teach it. I'm like, here's the outline for your for your, for your, what I call my pod pitch guesting, guest speaking request template, I think, is what I call it. But, I can tell you this. A lot of it is based on on authenticity and a little bit of prework. So I called out an audience, if you noticed in that script. So I we wanna call out our audience.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:33:40]:

How do we serve and then also Some authenticity. Right? And, I should actually pull up the framework, and I'll I could tell you more to it. But I'm a cut to the chase kind of a guy. Right? And I want there to be as little fluff as possible, And I want to authentically tell you why I'm here and what I wanna do and how we can serve each other, and And the script was designed to cut through all the the the BS of having to Follow you on Facebook to have to to build a relationship with you, on social media and send you gifts and all these things that so many people tell us to do. They're like, go follow them on Facebook and comment on their Content and do all this and do all that, right, which is great if that's authentic to you. Right? And I'm so I'm not saying any of that's bad, but What I am saying is that is that we want if we're gonna go on podcast at scale, Right? Which is what you wanna do, which is what I wanna do. We're gonna get our messages out there at scale. Like, we don't have time.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:35:05]:

I don't have time. I have a small team. We don't have time to befriend everybody on Facebook first.

Bryan McAnulty [00:35:13]:

Yeah. Yeah. It makes sense. I remember so My assistant saw your message, and she thought, hey. This is probably pretty good, and then she showed it to me. And I remember, like, there wasn't any love, like what you're saying. Like, it got to the point. There's no, like, here's who I am.

Bryan McAnulty [00:35:28]:

Here's a whole, like, paragraph all about me. It was speaking directly to, like, this is How I can provide value to your audience and, like, all that kind of thing. Like, I got it right away. I didn't feel like, oh, what is all this information that I have to to go through to to make a decision or not? It was really clear on, like, the proposition you were making.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:35:47]:

Yeah. Perfect. Thank you, and thank you for that feedback. Right? Because that that's what I was trying to do, and and and it's up to us as the person wanting to go on the shows to go, okay. Like, I looked at your audience, and I'm like, I literally believe I can help your audience. Right? So I know that. So I'm like, great. This is Fantastic.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:36:08]:

Like, I can help your audience. Right? And and the other thing about it is I can talk about podcasting, guesting, telling stories, telling our customer stories, getting testimonials, all this kind of stuff all day. I love it. I do it for free. Right? So that that's the space I'm coming from too. So I'm like, hey. How can I serve? Here's the value proposition, And then here is a little give. Like, I did take some time to look at your podcast.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:36:37]:

I did take some time. Right? Because at the end, I was like, hey. By the way, I love your podcast. I love that interview you did. There was a lady. Yeah. I can't remember her name, but she was, Crystal,

Bryan McAnulty [00:36:48]:

I think, that we're talking about.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:36:50]:

What's that?

Bryan McAnulty [00:36:51]:

Crystal Bonnet, I think you were mentioning her. Yeah.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:36:54]:

I just loved how she was authentic in talking about her current challenges, and I was like, yeah. Like, that's That was great. Right? That inspired me to to hang in there through the entrepreneurial challenge, right, to that journey. And so, Yeah. It's like, let's cut to the chase. You've got an audience. I can serve your audience. And, yeah, I did at least take a minute to know that, yeah, you've got a show, and I listened, and I I can serve your audience.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:37:24]:

Does that make sense?

Bryan McAnulty [00:37:25]:

Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. Yeah. And I think that's also I guess for anybody listening to this from the perspective of someone who has a podcast and, like, Would receive an email like that. I guess now, like, thinking through this myself, like, how how would I approach it? What I can realize is, like, the people that the kind of people we would reject right away are those where, like, it's something really generic and they say, like, oh, this person should be on your podcast, blah blah blah blah. And it's just this pitch where, like, we have to think too hard to even decide, like, are they a fit? Like and and we have to try to, like, process that. And oftentimes, It's just maybe they even would be, but it's just too much work.

Bryan McAnulty [00:38:05]:

And we said, no. We're just we're just gonna deal with the guests that we have. And so without, like, being so like, you don't wanna be so, generic and just blasting everyone, like, trying to be on everyone's podcast. But at the same time, like, the point you're making is you also don't have to spend, like, all this time, like, engaging and building a relationship with the person directly so so much so that you don't have time to actually reach out to enough podcasts. And so yeah. So you found this this balance where you're making it clear that you understand what they're doing. You're You're making it clear what you do and what you can offer the audience. Yeah.

Bryan McAnulty [00:38:46]:

I like that. Yeah.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:38:47]:

Thank you for that. And and, you know, you know who Johnny Lee Dumas is, I'm assuming.

Bryan McAnulty [00:38:52]:

Yeah. Yeah.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:38:53]:

Awesome. Entrepreneurs on Fire. That podcast, you know, he's he's, very well known for that podcast. Has, I don't know, However many hundreds of thousands of downloads a month or whatever it is, but I had an opportunity to see him to see him, Speak at actually at Funnel Hacking Live a few years ago, and, he said he basically said, you know, like podcasters are busy. You're busy. Brian is a busy guy. Right? And and they don't have time to to to come up with the ideas or not that we don't want to or it's you said it great. Like, you're busy.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:39:33]:

If I can frame the idea for you, and that's in that email what it does as well. It's like, hey. Here's the name of here's what we could literally call the podcast episode, And here are some points you can speak to. Right? Solves a whole bunch of problems, and I'm here to serve. So Just a that up a little bit. Yeah. Awesome.

Bryan McAnulty [00:39:52]:

Alright. Well, one of the things we like to do on this show is I like to have every guest ask a question to the audience. If you could think of anything to ask our audience, whether it's something you're curious about, something you kinda wanna get everybody thinking about, what would that be? Yeah.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:40:09]:

I love that. I have to cough. I'm on the tail end of Cold or allergies or something. Sorry about that. No worries. Thank goodness for a production team. Right? So, yes, I did write down a question, and, excuse me, and so I know that your audience Our creators, right, that are creating courses, that are learning how they're at some part of this of this journey of this arc of of I'm an expert. I've got a message To bring to market that I can help people these learnings.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:40:48]:

So how am I gonna do it? So they're like, oh, let's get on HEIGHTS platform and build a course, right, to Perhaps they're at the other end of it, like the lady who you mentioned, Barbara, I think her name was, who's, like, built a business. Right? And now she's Figuring out how to scale it to 7 or 8 or 9 figures or whatever it is. Right? So my question to to to To you, that person is, as a creator, what's your biggest challenge when it comes to driving traffic To your content, to your courses. And maybe a better way to say it is, what's your biggest challenge when it comes to getting your Eyeballs on your content or even better, what's your biggest challenge when you're putting yourself out there?

Bryan McAnulty [00:41:39]:

Awesome. Yeah. Good thing to think about. Alright, Misha. Well, before we get going, where else can people find you online?

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:41:46]:

Awesome. Go to guesting guide .comguestingguide.com, and I have this great, A podcast tour guesting guide that answers the top 10 questions on, on on going on a guest Speaking tour, it's got, tips in there on how to find podcasts more podcasts than you, know what to do with to speak on, How to get emails, how to write that pitch, you know, that email pitch, everything. So guesting guide .com. Click on it for free, and, it'll get you started on the right path.

Bryan McAnulty [00:42:23]:

Alright. Awesome. Thanks so much, Mitra.

Mischa Zvegintzov [00:42:26]:

Thank you