Esther Kiss [00:00:00]:

And we actually generated over $1,800,000 in new revenue just with that one campaign. And then when we did the second book. It did even better.

Bryan McAnulty [00:00:09]:

Welcome to the creator's adventure, where we interview creators from around the world hearing their stories about growing a business. Well, this is the true value of being featured in mainstream media and TV and what PR strategies should you prioritize for your business? Today's guest has the answers. Hey, everyone. I'm Brian McAnulty, the founder of Heights platform. Let's get into it. Hey, everyone. We're here today with Esther Kish She is an entrepreneur speaker PR educator and the founder of born to influence, a boutique PR and marketing agency specializing in helping entrepreneurs and founders get more publicity, leads, and else. Beyond just the increased brand awareness, Esther's unique take on PR has resulted in her clients becoming New York Times best selling authors, solved after speakers, and regular featured guest experts on TV, radio, business magazines, and top tier podcasts. Esther, welcome to the show.

Esther Kiss [00:01:14]:

Thank you so much for having me, Brian.

Bryan McAnulty [00:01:17]:

Yeah. I'm, glad to talk with you. I know we've been Facebook friends for for quite a while, but we haven't actually, got to really have a conversation. So

Esther Kiss [00:01:25]:

I know. This is so great now.

Bryan McAnulty [00:01:27]:

Yeah. So my first question for you is what would you say is the biggest thing that either you did or you are doing that has helped you to achieve the freedom to do what you enjoy?

Esther Kiss [00:01:38]:

I think building the right relationships with a players in the industry is what helped me the most, connecting with people and genuinely trying to help them wherever I can that help me build a reputation and give the opportunities to work with some of their biggest thought leaders in the space and And that, you know, brought in business after that, but really started with just leading with generosity and the spirit of giving.

Bryan McAnulty [00:02:02]:

Awesome. Yeah. That's that's great. I think, like, I know this right away. On your Facebook profile there, you've got, like, picture of you next to, like, Gary Vaynerchuk, Taylopez, Grant Cardo, and like, you meet everybody. So that's great. I think

Esther Kiss [00:02:19]:

you kinda have to, even if you are not in PR, really great to build your network because, you know, a lot of people say that, it matters, like, how many people you know, but really also what matters who knows you. Right? So if you're thinking about some of those people who you mentioned or or anybody who would be an influential person in your industry, they are the people that your ideal clients will be asking for recommendations and referrals. How should I go about this? Who should I connect if I want to get this kind of service? And then, you know, being recommended, that's that's always nice.

Bryan McAnulty [00:02:54]:

Yeah. Yeah. That's a great point. Yeah. I always, I mean, one of the things I like to say to course creators, especially, like, I know this from our audience. Like, a lot of people like to build the product. And they get a little bit stuck in that, and they end up with this amazing thing that they've created, but they didn't tell anybody about it. And you want people to know about you so that way you can get customers and and make that that impact that you wanna make.

Esther Kiss [00:03:19]:

Absolutely. And it's really key too that you start talking about it and build an audience before you even launch a product. So, for example, if you have a course, you should be posting content that covers some of the subtopics that will be included in the course. And you can give away, like, basically all of it because still people who are consuming content and that you build a trust with them, they'll be very happy to purchase the the ready product And then the other thing, of course, with PR, for example, let's say if you have a book launch and you want to make sure that that book becomes the best seller, you will definitely want to start your media interviews, like, 6 to 8 months before they book launch date because you want to ramp up those pre orders ahead of time.

Bryan McAnulty [00:04:01]:

Yep. Yeah. Definitely. Yeah. With book launches, in particular, I've experienced only secondhand, but, like, how crazy it actually is of all the marketing preparation that goes into before the book is even out. But, yeah, definitely, of course, is the same.

Esther Kiss [00:04:18]:

Yeah. A lot of people just think that if I do self publish, which is absolutely a great route, and most of my clients who are authors are self publishing that everybody, but most of them it definitely gives you the flexibility to, you know, do it tomorrow if you have the manuscript ready and everything is edited. But if you think about it, the lead time for many media outlets can be several weeks to several months. So as an example, if you want to be in some of the biggest podcast, it could be 6 to 8 months before that interview gets published. Or if you want to be in a publication like Forbes or in, that will take a while too. So you want to make sure that you allow yourself that prep time and that lead time so that you can get the most, best for it that you can generate.

Bryan McAnulty [00:05:01]:

Yeah. Yeah. It's great to to find that out ahead of time, I think, because and, like, for those listening, if you're completely new to this idea, like, That doesn't mean like, oh, well, building the relationship, then eventually getting them to agree. Like, no, that's after they've agreed, you've already recorded it. It's still gonna take time before it actually gets published.

Esther Kiss [00:05:20]:

Yes.

Bryan McAnulty [00:05:22]:

Alright. So today, you're the CEO of a successful PR company called Born to Influence, in our research, we saw that it all started from a podcast. So Can you actually tell us the story of how the podcast turned into the company of today?

Esther Kiss [00:05:40]:

Yeah. It was kind of by accident. I think maybe it was divine guidance who knows. But at the time, I just discovered 10 years ago. I discovered this whole world of online coaches, a courses and subject matter experts who are making a really great living and and a great business online. And so I knew that I wanted to play in that space. Now my background is in marketing, so I knew that I could do something, but I didn't know exactly what. And so we had this brilliant idea with a friend of mine to start podcast. Her name is Meta Miller. And so the idea was that we would connect with thought leaders like Gary Vaynerchuk, Carrie Marshall, John Vayner, like, for some of the relate the biggest players in this space and interview them. And that way, we would build those relationships and we'll figure out what to do from there. And so every time we did an interview, a podcast interview, at the end, I would turn off the recording and I would say that, hey. I know you this book coming out or you have this event, you have this conference that you're doing or a course that you're launching. Would you like to be on other shows as well? And they always said yes. And so I just did it purely completely for free just to help them and to build those relationships and connect with people like what we were talking about, right, like building those relationships in general. It's important. And so work it out, and a lot of people were asking me that, hey, can you help me too? If I one of my clients came to me first, and and he was like, he he was running the Facebook ads for one of his author clients. And so they were doing quite well with the book launch, but they wanted to get public the city. And so he asked me that, hey. Can you help this guy get us a podcast? And I'm like, yeah. Sure. And he's like, yeah. But this time, you have to charge for it. So I literally went to Google, and they they googled, like, how much does a publicist make? And that was the starting place. And and now it it grew to this agency where do traditional media, TV, radio, magazines, and then also a lot of online media podcasts, YouTube shows, whatever platforms we can get that has that person's ideal audience.

Bryan McAnulty [00:07:40]:

Awesome. Yeah. And I think what I could add to that is having a podcast is, is really great just for all those connections as you said.

Esther Kiss [00:07:49]:

Yeah. Yeah.

Bryan McAnulty [00:07:50]:

For me, if if this had no marketing value to us at all, like, I'd keep doing it just to be able to, like, I get to sit down and talk with cool people. So, and like you said, also, like, when the recording stops, like, we're doing business. Like, it's not done. So, So, like, I I'm talking with, the guests, like, after we we finished the recording and we're thinking, like, well, what can we do together? Is there something we can help each other with? And, like, not not trying to to sell them something necessarily, but there's value in those relationships built.

Esther Kiss [00:08:21]:

It it happens. So often that, especially with podcasts, not so much with TV, but but with podcasts, it tends to be something that comes up a lot let's say that person to podcaster also likes to do JV webinars, right, where they promote other people's online courses, or they want to promote the book that you might have you know, coming out soon, or it could be that they can introduce you to someone. And vice versa, like, when you and I connected, you asked me to be on the show and they said, hey. Let's chat a little bit, like, even before the show, because I might have some clients who could be a good fit for this particular show. And so you just never know. There are so many opportunities that we don't initially think of they can be very beneficial on the win win for everyone.

Bryan McAnulty [00:09:03]:

Yeah. Yeah. So we we're mentioned here, like, having these right connections and networking, so when you started born to influence, how did you start to build those connections, like, apart from the podcast? Because, like, I've noticed you were also, like, you've been on like, TV and everything like that. So how did the rest of that help, like, or or happen? Was it just, like, you started doing the podcast and then, like, it was kinda natural from there, or, like, was there anything specific?

Esther Kiss [00:09:31]:

TB came after. So my background is in marketing. I also had a little bit of a stint in acting when I used to live in LA, but I would say all of those things, like, you know, having the technique to speak on camera and and those kinds of things helped, but it wasn't the conscious. Like, this is the master plan that you're gonna go after. It kind of organically unfolded. So it started like, how I shared before with interviewing this podcast guest and starting to make those introductions. And then someone literally asked me to help their clients. So that was the first step. And then when I really went into it and I jumped in with both feet, I started thinking, how can I be creative to help this clients as much as possible? So we knew that podcasts are really, really good for subject matter experts because they tend to be very focused. Their audiences are niche audiences that are really generally ready to buy or very open to buying certain courses, products, services, etcetera. And then on the branding side, you definitely want to have some TV and radio and magazines, the publications that are in your niche. Like, for example, Forbes or ink or entrepreneurs are important. And so I started building these relationships with writers, editors, producers, and I started learning about what are they looking for? What are some of the topics and the experts so that they are looking to cover in their upcoming articles, upcoming interviews, And they're still connecting them, and and that's how it unfolded.

Bryan McAnulty [00:10:57]:

Great. Yeah. I'm curious personally. So, like, I've been on other people's podcasts, but I've never really tried to, like, get on Forbes or get on TV and things like that. And I understand the value of, like, just the credibility part is huge for people to see that and see, like, oh, you were these people talk with you so you you must be important or or good at what you do. But, would you say, like, is that the main thing of that, or do those sources, like, tend to bring you, like, traffic or an audience as well?

Esther Kiss [00:11:29]:

It's it's really both. So if you have a product that is interesting to the general public, then absolutely it's both great for brand and then also great for immediately getting those customers. Right? So let's say, for example, you sell a supplement product and you're a nutritionist, right, or you have an online course that helps with 4 hormones or something like that. That would be something that reaches a very wide audience. So going on TV or, like, let's say you in Doctor Oz or or anything like that, it will be really, really a huge spike in traffic to your website. So that's the immediate effect if your offer is something that's super mainstream. If your offer is more niche, like, let's say, for example, your helping online entrepreneurs with their Facebook ads or you're helping them with, like, how to write your book or something like that. That's not really for a big audience. Then in that case, I would still very much recommend doing some TV because first of all, it will give you that credibility and build trust and that helps with conversions. Secondly, and and here's the thing where a lot of people fall short. Right? They do the publicity and due to these those interviews, they see it spike in traffic to their website, and they just kind of like, okay. I'm done. It's not done right. What you wanna do is take this video lips or take those articles that you have in Forbes or any of those big brand name publications and integrate it with your sales and marketing funnels. So for example, if you're launching an online course and you have, let's say, an email option and people get your freebie and then over time through those email as that you will actually sell them into the course. Right? Now you can take your TV clip where you are featured, let's say, on ABC or Fox or whatever it may be, and embed it in those emails, right, or your magazine, like, take a screenshot of your article and put it in there because it builds credibility so fast. If you're running ads, I mean, you're crazy not to use your publicity pieces in those campaigns as content because that really, from the perspective of the audience, it's like, wow. This person is everywhere. Oh my goodness. You know? But you're putting the info you're putting those pieces of content in front of them very strategically. And so it tends to really shorten the sales cycle, and it can, drop your client acquisition costs by as much as 90%. So We've seen in this work anywhere from free plus shipping offers all the way up to, like, 6 figure agency offers. It just helps build that trust and credibility so fast. And people are much, much more likely to share, for example, a video clip that was from a TV interview or a Forbes article Right? They will share it with their friends as opposed to, like, here's a marketing email. You know what it's gonna post that on their Facebook. Right? So so you want to be mindful with how can I use it and make it work for you for years years to come?

Bryan McAnulty [00:14:17]:

Yeah. That's a really excellent point because we've said before, and I think I've talked about it with another guest too in a different way that you have some of these great pieces of content that you'll create over the years. And you won't you don't wanna just, like, leave them be. And then, like, that was that. Hopefully, you create another good one. You want everybody who joins your audience joins your email list, you want them all to see all of your best work.

Esther Kiss [00:14:41]:

Yeah.

Bryan McAnulty [00:14:41]:

And so if that includes, like, you being in Forbes or or being TV, you want to let those people know that why why miss that opportunity. So I think that's really, absolutely pointed that out. And

Esther Kiss [00:14:50]:

and let's say let's say if you have a coaching offer or an online score of course offer and say the offer is $2000. Right? So some people might be ready to immediately buy. That's a typical price for an online course. But not everybody will majority of people will need some nurturing. And so if you can speed that process up and build the trust much quicker by using this publicity pieces in almost every touch point when you're contacting them, especially if you have a good library of, let's say, you have a handful of TV clips, a bunch of articles, you do ton of podcast, you can pull the best pieces that would be relevant to the talking point in in your overall marketing. And then you can connect the 2 together. And there is just such a power in seeing someone who is not just talking directly to their target market that, hey. Look at me. How great I am. Now it's like somebody else is saying about you that you are the expert in this. That's it's priced us.

Bryan McAnulty [00:15:46]:

Yeah. Yeah. It's excellent point too. So I wanna, I guess, start to shift this for our creators to figure out, like, how they can begin to implement this. So can you think of maybe one specific case study where you help the client of yours get exceptional results? And share maybe, like, what did that client need or, like, ask for when they reached out to you, and then how did you help them?

Esther Kiss [00:16:11]:

Yeah. So a client who I'm working with currently, her name is Morgan, because McDonald, she's gonna be on the show here too. So I started working with Morgan 6 months And when she came to me, she told me that she wanted to get more opportunities to speak on stages, right, at conferences and events. And for her to be able to do that, we want to make her the best candidate possible when she submits for really large high level events. Right? Like, we're not talking about these little pay to play kind of things, but, like, we're really, she would reach a good audience, MS. And if you think about it from the perspective of those business owners or conference organizers, they get so many applications of potential speakers, and they want to bring the best ones who, first of all, ideally have a form. If you have a great social media following or a great email list, that will help them promote the event too. In turn, that's one. Secondly, if it's a person who has been featured on ABC, CBS, Fox, all these different magazines, all these different podcasts, they know that their audience will either have heard of them. Or if not, they will at least, you know, have the impact of the credibility that these media futures will bring. So if there are 2 speakers who have the exact same expertise and the same kind of, content that they can share who they're gonna pick. Somebody who's an unknown or somebody who's been featured in the media. Right? So that was her goal. And so in 6 months and she hasn't done anything other than a handful of podcasts before she came, to work with me. And so in 6 months time, I was just looking at today. We we got her in Forbes, business insider, CMS wire, Yahoo News, MSN, n b not NBC yet, but, Nasdaq. So, like, a bunch of, like, huge huge news sites and and TV and big business publications, as well as a lot of, niche targeted publications to podcasts. Some of them, you know, range from 10,000 listeners to over a million. So, really, that it runs a gamut, right, and we want to make sure that we are as targeted as possible. She's a publishing expert and the writing coach. So we got her in writer's digest. And, like, a lot of, like, super shipper targeted publications that make sense for her as well as mainstream media. So that would be a good example of what you can do as an overall strategy blending both the traditional and the online media side to get the best results possible.

Bryan McAnulty [00:18:35]:

Yeah. That's great. So for, like, I guess it's gonna depend on the the creator or coach or what what they're doing. But what type of media do you think that a creator should focus on in general? And, like, how how did they decide, like, where to start or what's the best for them.

Esther Kiss [00:18:52]:

That's that's a really important point. So you want to think about what kind of platform do you already have? What kind of publicity you have done so far. Let's say you are starting completely from scratch and you haven't done anything. Then the question would be, what is your goal with this? Are you looking to build industry relationships like what we were talking earlier. Right? Podcasts are a great rep to go. If you're looking to get a lot of leads and sales, you really want to bump your revenue. If you're, if you have a niche offer, like we talked about earlier too, then podcasts will be a fantastic way to go. Now if you want to get the branding aspect of it, I would definitely say go after mainstream media too. And with that, what you want to consider is how can I fit what I know into what the media is already interested in? So let's say, you know, if we stick with Morgan's example, she's a book publishing expert, like, The average TV viewer is not here for that. Right? But she is really, really good with using technology. They use a lot of AI. She has case studies of how she bumped up her webinar attendance and got, you know, a lot of great results, improved results compared to before using chatgy PD, for example, with different prompts to to improve her marketing there. So those were really great case studies to share on, on mainstream media on how these results came about. So that got her Yahoo Finance and, like, all these other ones that I mentioned earlier. And, if you look at on the TV side, we just got, got her an on camera interview on Fox because just recently, a federal judge has decided that AI generated art cannot get copyright. So that's a news item. Right? So now we can pull her expertise into that because books are often works of art. How does this impact authors? Right? So she can speak to that. So this is something that you want to, think about. Like, how can I break down my expertise into different topics and subtopics? And then keep an eye on the news and literally you can just put in your topic and then go to Google news and see what were what was featured on TV or in major magazines and publications in the last couple of days, and you can use that as a lead in as a hook to why now it's important to cover topic. Right? And then let's say you saw something on ABC, you might go to Forbes with that or vice versa. Right? So different types of publications, but they all wanna kind of getting on the trending news. So if they see that a hefty media outlet covered, this type of a story, now they want somebody to be covered on their platform too.

Bryan McAnulty [00:21:25]:

Yeah. That sounds good. So in terms of, like, marketing and PR, I think it can sometimes be challenging to understand what the impact of a campaign is when it comes down to, like, the numbers and revenue. So whether you found to be effective in helping clients convert that media exposure into actual revenue, like, and not just the credibility part.

Esther Kiss [00:21:48]:

Absolutely. So one thing that you definitely want to think about if you're data driven is how can I track this in my funnel? So what talked about earlier with, for example, you could put together an email nurture sequence that has your publicity pieces and look at the conversions there. And you could do another campaign with the exact same copy and the exact same type of simple audience, but without the publicity and see, which one brings news more buyers, same for Facebook or any other kind of PBC, right, you can see your lead costs when you're including these pieces versus when you're not. So it's very easy to see the difference what we have seen is it literally drops client acquisition costs by as much as 90%. So if you were to spend a $1000 on Facebook ads, and you guys, let's say, you know, on 10 customers out of it, now you might be able to get a hunt. I don't wanna say 100, but, like, you can get significantly more simply because you're looting your publicity. To give you, a very specific example that one of my clients Ryan LaVec did. I work with him on both of his books for, for, ask and choose. And so when we worked on the campaign for us, he wanted to be on all the podcasts that are for entrepreneurs and online marketers. And so we booked him on about 80 shows, and he's so data driven. Like, he really understands Internet marketing and and just he's just very, very into understanding the exact lead source. So what he did is he would do a unique coup on code for every single show that he did. Right? And so if somebody listened to a podcast and they saw that that they became a buyer from there and they used that particular coupon code, now they know that they came from that podcast. And so we were able to track, and we actually generated over $1,800,000 in new revenue to his business just with that one campaign. And now when we did the second book, it did even better because by then, of course, he was well known because we did all the publicity before for the previous book. So I will say it's not perfect to the penny. It's not like having, like, a super, you know, like, I don't know, high risk or something like that, whereas, like, tries to really track and and attribute everything. Just because, like, even with the podcast, if you have a coupon code for this show, let's say, They may have listened to 5 other shows before they pull the trigger. So it's not gonna be perfect, but you will definitely see a huge difference compared to not doing any kind of publicity.

Bryan McAnulty [00:24:11]:

Awesome. So in your experience, what would you say are some common misconceptions that entrepreneurs have when it comes to PR or media relations. And how can they overcome them?

Esther Kiss [00:24:24]:

One of the biggest misconceptions is that it's not important. And I think we discussed here that, you know, if you're not doing it fine, but your competition is And if you let's say if you're a hormone expert and there is, like, another one who is actually being on TV all the time and in podcasts and everything, they're gonna win because they will build a much better reputation. So that's important. The second thing is understanding how to do it correctly. So if you just go on podcast really, Nilly and you start chatting, it's fine. I mean, you're gonna have a great time. A lot of these conversations are really enjoyable. Nobody's ever gonna grill you, like, in a political interview, right, for for the most part. But you wanna be prepared. So what, for example, what we do with our clients is we make sure that they really know what are some of those subtopics and those key components of their messaging that resonates with their audience. How can we include that in all of the interviews that they do? So you never wanna be someone who's robotic, and they always say the same five talking points, especially if they wrote a book. And now all they can talk about is the book. That's not good. Right? You want to bring it fresh stuff that just happened, like, give them a golden nugget that you only shared on that show. Like, for example, I never talked publicly about Morgan's campaign before it, and we had the chance to talk about that. So there's always interesting things that you can bring in that's fresh, and then somebody who listens to that interview, what are they gonna do? They might just go and straight from you, but more likely, they'll go and listen to another podcast, check out another interview, look at your social media content, and you have that repetition where the core content is it kind of seeps in over time in their head and your audience has said, but also they always feel like they're learning something new from you. So having the preparedness of of doing interviews correctly and make sure that they're compelling and they will convert, that's important. And then the other aspect of it is to is that a podcast interview, for example, is 20 minutes, half an hour, sometimes an hour. You can be much more technical. You can be a little bit more long winded. Whereas, for instance, if you do TV, it's gonna be 3 to 4 minutes. So you really have to be 6¢ and to talk in a different way, talking sound bites and and make sure that you're appropriate to the media format that you're going after.

Bryan McAnulty [00:26:38]:

Yeah. Yeah. I agree that's really important and, like, from my small amount of experience and going on other podcasts, it became pretty immediately clear that you have to know your own story and, like, the points that you wanna talk about very well, because you don't wanna depend on the person interviewing you to do that. Like, yes, they they want to do a good job. They they want to kinda, like, champion you and and help, like, tell your story. But they don't necessarily know how to ask the right questions to get that information out of you. And so important to not not only know, like, as you said, those couple, like, key points because you you just repeat those everywhere, but you wanna have something new and something that you know would be good to talk about that they would wanna talk about anyway that you can tie into the whole thing, even if they don't ask you the question in the perfect way to get that out.

Esther Kiss [00:27:28]:

Exactly. And and that's the thing that most podcasters are not professional journalists. Some are, but most of them are not. And so they will ask the questions typically based on how they like to receive information. So it's either gonna be very story driven, like, telling me how you came to do this, like, to, you know, me about the moment when this happened. And then there will be other podcasters who will just tell me exactly the steps. How do we do this? Give me the nitty gritty And so you, as the guest, it's important for you to understand that you kinda need to do both. Right? So, for example, if they ask about a story. Like, how earlier you asked me about how did I come to, to run this agency? What was the the beginnings of it and and what was the story? I gave you the story and then I also gave you examples of specifically what we did. Right? So when you're doing something like this, when you're teaching your audience, how to do something, it needs to be, like, really, really juicy where they can go and implement it, or at least they can see it in their mind's eye how this would work because that will build trust. But then also share a story of either a client or something that you've done yourself so that it has the story aspect too that keeps people's attention.

Bryan McAnulty [00:28:38]:

Yeah. Yeah. That's excellent. I mean, I can tell, like, you definitely did a great job with that on, on this podcast. So I think, like, I'm interested in wanting to learn more and and, like, how this can help me. I'm sure that our audience is as well. Of the things I'd like to do on the show is have you ask or every guest ask a question to our audience. So if you could think of anything to ask our audience, whether something you're curious about, or something you you kinda wanna get them thinking about. What would that be?

Esther Kiss [00:29:10]:

I would encourage you to think about where you might have missed opportunities. Because now that we talked about some of the impact of what publicity can have and, you know, the subconscious as well as the direct impact, where are where maybe you have seen someone else who has a similar expertise or similar offer to yours, where they've employed publicity really well and people tend to gravitate towards them, or maybe you'll have missed out. Another way of looking at this question is where are some of those hidden treasures, those platforms where maybe nobody's thinking about it in terms of media, but really it is because it is connecting with a new audience to you. I actually just posted about this on Facebook earlier today is look at platforms. Like, for example, GoDaddy Right? They have 20,000,000 customers. They have so many followers on social media. They do quotes from experts. So if you're in the entrepreneur online marketing space where you're selling to other entrepreneurs. I mean, GoDaddy, it's domain owners. It's exactly your your perfect audience. They definitely should target platforms like that, or like AmEx has a podcast. Right? They're not just a credit card company. They're also a merchant processors. So might want to think about being on their show or being included in their email newsletter. There are all these things where we are thinking of media in terms of, like, ABC and you should have those And you should also have these, other platforms that connect you like SaaS founders, for example, who are targeting your target market, your vendors, your suppliers, if they do content marketing, ask to be included. It really, really helps.

Bryan McAnulty [00:30:46]:

Yeah. Yeah. That's, that's something really good to think about. And I can say, like, from the behind the scenes point, like, Like, we, like, everybody who's making a podcast or making this content, like, they don't wanna have to do more work. And, like, like, the example that you had of GoDaddy, like, even though, like, every business gets tons of, like, pitches and cold emails and everything, every single day. But if you can stand out to someone like that, And, like, that's the kind of thing. Like, I didn't know GoDaddy's doing that kind of thing. You know? But, like, definitely, like, they they wanna target that. And if they are, like, you can reach out to them. And and say, hey. And, like, if if you're sending that email to the right spot, the person looking at that is going to consider it and say, like, oh, this is I don't have to go and find somebody for, like, the quote or or whatever it is. This might be a good one. And, yeah, you have a much better chance, I think, of, standing out on those kind of things versus, like, pitching to, like, just the big, big brand like media outlets that everybody knows.

Esther Kiss [00:31:46]:

You absolutely should do both. So it's it takes patience. And and even, you know, we were talking about Morgan earlier. I will say that part of the reason why we've been so successful with her campaign, like, really within a few months, like, basically all the mainstream top tier athletes that you can think of. We got her featured and a ton of podcasts and and all these online media. But, and part of the reason is she is very fast with responding. So if I email her and, hey. We need a quote for this, she will have it to me either the same day or the next day, but well before the deadline. And the reason this is important is because if you think about it from a journalist perspective, especially with big name media outlets, they're under a ton of pressure. The breaking news is changing all the time. They are expected to write sometimes 5 to 6 articles a day. And so they can be hunting after their sources. All of a sudden, hey, you have the quote here. Whoever brings what is appropriate there that they that would suit their peace and and they are first to the race, so to speak. They'll get featured. So you want to make sure that you're really responsive.

Bryan McAnulty [00:32:51]:

Yeah. That's a great tip. Alright. Well, Esther, this was a excellent interview. Before you get going, where else can people find you online?

Esther Kiss [00:32:59]:

Well, connect with me either on social. You'll find me. My name is Esther Kish, k I s s, or at my website born to influence.com. And if you would like to learn deeper about publicity and and connect with me more either, you can email me [email protected], or I do have also a publicity quick start guide that will help you with all the first steps and and getting all your ducks in a row to start attracting media attention, and you can download that for free at borntoinfluence.comforward/start.

Bryan McAnulty [00:33:31]:

Awesome. Alright. Thanks so much.

Esther Kiss [00:33:33]:

Thank you.

Bryan McAnulty [00:33:35]:

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