Bryan McAnulty: Welcome to the creator's adventure, where we interview creators from around the world, hearing their stories about growing a business. My name is Bryan McAnulty. I'm the founder of Heights platform. And today I'm talking with Jorge Hernandez about how his transition from music production to learning online marketing.

Let him on a journey to offering this business in the box type service to real estate agencies. And now his passion for online course creation.

We're here today with Jorge Hernandez, the founder of MDI digital marketing agency. He is an online business entrepreneur, passionate about digital marketing. He's worked for companies such as Intel, B, B V a KPMG, and has helped hundreds of companies increase their convers. And generate sales on the internet.

Jorge, welcome to the show. Thank

Jorge Hernandez: you very much. It's a pleasure to seeing you.

Bryan McAnulty: Yeah, it's always great to be able to talk with some of our customers and hear from them and you just let me know right before we started, actually you are one of the ones who helped us in our platform with the Spanish localizations for Spanish language, which is awesome to hear

Yeah. So my first question for you is you're a, a real estate and digital marketing expert. So can you tell us a little bit about your story and how you got started and got to this point where you're at now in your career?

Jorge Hernandez: Okay. I'm gonna start with, with the, with the story. Let's see. You know, I'm telecommunication engineer and sound engineer.

And when I finished my studies in sound engineering I was, you know, producing electronic music as well at the same time in my spare time. So it was like, like my dream come through. So when I finish it, I start searching for a job here in Spain. And I didn't find any job as mixing engineer or mastering engineer or sound engineer, nothing to do with that.

So I was like really, really frustrated. And I said, okay, what gonna do now? I don't know what to do. And, and I spent like few weeks thinking about what to. And at the end, I said, Hey, I'm just gonna create my own job. I wanna, I wanna do it. I wanna at least get some experience on, on this need. And, and, and I spend four years studying this studies, so I need to, to get it done and, and make some work on it.

so I create the website called audio master in studio, do net. It was my first business online and yeah, creating the website. It wasn't that hard. But then when I had the website, I said, okay, nobody is coming. I'm not getting customers what's going on. I didn't know anything about digital marketing or whatever.

So I start searching the net and surfing. Just to figure out what to do to bring some customers, to bring traffic to my side. And, and I found out something called ACO search, changing optimization, and I start learning from that. And, yeah, and to be honest, in, in six months, I got more customer that I could handle during, in my day by day work.

And that's great. It was like, okay, I'm working in what I. I'm spending like 10 hours, 14 hours a day in the studio producing my own music, helping others to produce their music mastering and release in, in record levels in platforms like Spotify or track it down that is closed already now, or pit port, these kind of platform.

And it was like a dream and true, you know, and, but somehow I realized that it was not scalable. I was selling my, my time and that's it. And you have, your limitation is like, you have a gap. So I said, okay, eh, I am happy with that. I. I don't mind if I don't go out with friends. I don't mind if I don't meet my girl.

I don't mind. I was just, you know, in enrolling with, with that beginning of the job and the project and I was happy, but after a year or something, I got ums in my right left and my right ear. I don't know if you know what it is, but it's just a tone in a frequency, just, you know, ringing 24 hours every single day for the rest of your life.

So it was like really, really frustrating. I, I felt like really. Destroyed at that point. And yeah, and I decide like give it up and, and like start, you know using what I learned in digital marketing, like in, in, in ACO field, just to, you know, giving services to customers and starting from that point, because, you know, the, the LDL thing was killing.

Luckily, I, I got better and, and that illness disappeared. So it was like a revamping by revamping myself and, and starting again with this digital theme. So, yeah, I said, okay. And I'm gonna start giving ACO services to companies and, and people that already know me and know what I did with audio master in the studio.

And Hey, I wanna, I want you to make me the same. And it was like, eh, you know, going from voice to voice and, and in, in that way. So it was when I started that online business, it was 2009. And I started digital company 2011 and yeah, I start taking every single project, all markets, any, any niche. And it was really, really, you know, hard work because.

Even though it's marketing, digital marketing and so on, but every single niche, you know

Bryan McAnulty: behaves. Yeah. Every, every niche you have to kind of learn things all over again in a way. Yeah.

Jorge Hernandez: Yeah. Yeah. So I was in that process of learning a lot of needs and, and yeah. Learning how to apply the digital marketing strategies to every single market.

So it was like a little bit crazy. I learned a lot of those times and. Yeah. And, and he was happy at that moment. And then I moved to France. And it was a little bit harder to get customers from Spain, living in France, even though you, you can work online and remotely. But, eh, I thought it was easier when I was here in Spain and when I moved, eh, it was a, a really bad idea moving to, to France.

But yeah, I couldn't go back for that moment. So I decide making a neat website and monetize them with Google absence. So I just, you know, all my knowledge in different markets start, you know using for creating that Google apps and website. So I made, I made a living from that for a few years.

And then when I went back to, to Spain, I said, okay, where am I gonna live now? Should I live in Madrid? Should I live in a where I'm from? Should I try something new? And something new thing was coming to aand where I'm living now. It was in 2013. And this is a town in the east of Spain and close to the city, close to the beach.

So pretty comfortable, convenient and easygoing city. That's nice. And you know, when I came here, it was like, Hey man, I love the international thing, the languages and so on because I was living in, in Copenhagen for one year and a half Inor in Germany for few time as well. And in, in. In many places in, in Spain Madrid and the Paia, you know, so it was like, okay, I'm gonna try this digital marketing thing with the international thing.

And also the real estate market, because here it was like pumping. It was like a really crazy. Uh, lot of opportunities and it was a, a really green market if you related with digital marketing. So it was like, okay, I'm gonna specialize the agency only for realtors and real estate companies, you know, customers,

Bryan McAnulty: developers, when you decided to do that, did you, did you make the decision to do that only because you noticed there was this big opportunity for it or.

Do you feel like it was like, did you have any problems being so general before, like trying to do everything? Do you think that was too difficult?

Jorge Hernandez: Yeah, it became too difficult. And also I'm gonna, I'm gonna be honest. I got tired of black hat sale and making back links every single day and the same task day by day, you know, it was like really tiring.

And I need like, like enhance myself and learn more, more staff about copywriting, about funnels, about automations, about email marketing. All the digital marketing fields, not only ACO, but I wanted to learn more, more

Bryan McAnulty: stuff. So yeah. Well, I can relate to that because, so for my business, we started as like graphic and web design.

And then, and we also started kind of general saying, well, like I know a little bit about video too. We can do video for you if you need that. Or even like photography or something, but mainly graphic and web design which was actually like more traditional print design and web design at the time.

And this was back in 2009. And the websites then were a lot more simple, but we realized like we really enjoyed building the custom websites, making the unique design for someone. And then after doing that enough times though, like it felt like we were solving the same problem while everyone has a contact forum.

Everyone has the about us page. And so I think it's kind of similar. We kind of got in a way bored with that. We felt like we weren't learning anymore. So then it shifted into, well, what about web applications? Now we can build like this software. So we started building the software and now like every software product, there's all new challenges because now it's like, well, everyone has a login system, but then what about after that?

How, how is that software gonna work? So then we enjoyed the new challenges with that, but then we felt, okay, well, the clients always wanna mess it up. They always wanted to change something after you build it and say like, oh, well we need it this way. And so we thought, well, what if we can just build our own software and do it the way that we want.

And eventually that's what led us to our product height platform today. But it sounds like it was kind of similar for you doing the same kind of thing with the SEO and the back links and then thinking, well, how can I do something to continue learning in the digital marketing and doing new things?

Yeah, it is. I

Jorge Hernandez: mean, it is the same situation at the end, you realize. You can touch every single need. You can touch every single technology or fill in digital marketing. So it's like, okay, I'm gonna make a packet, a service, a really big, big service where I'm gonna make the best for my customer to get resolved.

It's gonna be like a high, high ticket. But that's, it is really always the same, the same funnel, the same track sources, the same implementation, everything, really procedure, procedure, and very automat automatized, and eh, something like business in a box, you know? So in that way we could give much more value to our customer because we, we take it to the end to, to get big results and also to specialize and be happy every single day, because, you know, I don't know how old are you, but I'm 40 now.

And it's like, You just, you watch, you know, behind you and it's like, oh my God, I spent all my life learning, learning and, and, and achieving challenges. So it's like, now you feel like, Hey, I wanna, I wanna go with everything I learn and all that experience, I'm gonna really change. Something for somebody I wanna get result real results.

You know, like in my case, selling houses to, to the world Europe from, from my customers here in Spain, in the, in the coast of Spain. So it was like getting something very specialized and forgetting about all the rest of the needs, because otherwise, yeah, you, you get crazy and

Bryan McAnulty: contract. So you realized you wanted to, to take what you learned and then.

You're ready to really wanna make an impact with that. That's so I wonder if you had to start again though from scratch, do you think that it was a good thing, that you tried all of these different things leading up to what you started with or, or not started with, but got to now, or if you had to start again, would you rather start with something like what you're doing now and just specialize in that earlier?

You know

Jorge Hernandez: what nowadays it depends on, on your objective. You know, I'm a very, very, very curious guy. I need to try every single thing and I really enjoy testing technologies, testing applications, testing, software testing, SaaS platforms. Uh, I enjoy that in, in my day by day, but. That doesn't pay the bills.

You know what I mean? So it is like, I'm getting a little bit tired of that and, and really thinking about making an impact. So about your question. Nowadays I wouldn't have study. Some engineering telecommunication engineering. I wouldn't do anything because you can just specialize so much with, with great programs that you can find on internet and do whatever you want in your life.

I mean, we are not touch about business, about marketing, about selling ourself, about building your brand about, so about your finance. We are not thoughts about a lot of staff that we, we it's a really must, but yeah. Yeah. Uh, for example, for me telecommunication engineering, it was like five years of hard studying, spending every single day in the, in the library studying or in my, in my room.

And it was like a waste of time completely for me, because it's like, they teach you to learn lunch. Eh, rocket to the moon, but you are not gonna do it. Never, maybe Ellen Musk, but not me. So yeah, it's not necessary so much stuff to make a living and enjoy your life and doing what, whatever you want to do with your life.

Nowadays, specialization is the key is the, the real key to make money, to be more productive, to, to enjoy your life and to make an impact in your customers. Specialization is the key.

Bryan McAnulty: Uh, I think that's a great insight. I, I would add to that, that if someone is, is really at the point that they're starting out now, maybe that you're just finishing school or something like this, and you're wondering what you're gonna do.

I think trying. All those different things is helpful at a certain point because it'll help inform you. Well, do I enjoy this or not? But in the long run, if you're thinking, well, I'm going to be the most successful because I'm going to do everything. Probably it's better to specialize in something.

Jorge Hernandez: I mean, if your objective is getting experience, learning, knowing a lot about everything, take my path.

If you wanna make money and specialize, just go for it, make your, you know, objective your target and make the task that help you to get closer to that.

Bryan McAnulty: Cool. So it sounds like you you've built what you're saying is like this almost business in a box kind of service for real estate agents and things like this.

Mm-hmm Is that like, would that be your main source of revenue? Like the main thing you do right now? Yeah, right now is

Jorge Hernandez: the main source. I mean it's a hundred percent of the income in the company. You know, it's we, we say we have a system with the algorithm you, you read on, on, on newspapers or whatever in the website.

And it's very, very optimized to get customers from the world Europe. Tate them mature them positioning the builder or the developer as an expert, as an expert in that area and showing their houses in appropriate way to touch the hearts and, and touch the paint pain in the way that they wanna see more.

They wanna visit the village they wanna visit. The, the property they wanna visit you know, talk to the agent and at the end, close the sale. That's the whole process in marketing, in sales. And you know, at the beginning, the first years when we start. It was not an ending product in the way that they didn't have good, good results.

Closing the deals, closing the sales. So I said, okay, we have to make something to improve their results because it it's. Okay. My part is the marketing and the digital marketing thing is not, is not my business, but I wanna make the good result on them and their business because tomorrow they are, they are not gonna pay you if they don't get results.

So exactly let's make a training for the telemarketing teams, the sales team to show them how the world strategy works, the digital strategy, how we get the, the, the leads, how we Tate them. And what's the. The buyer journey, they are gonna apply to that buyer in every single step, the script they have to use the mindset they have to, to, to have on that moment of the buyer and everything, just to make the, the, to close the deal in a more efficient way.

So in the past two, three years, we start, you know, training those guys. And getting better results. So now answering to your question, we are starting a new business line and it's gonna be like the master program, teaching agents and realtors to make everything we do, but

Bryan McAnulty: themselves. Sure. So this is like your online course.

This is what you're building with us right now. Right.

Jorge Hernandez: A big online course.

Bryan McAnulty: all right. All right. Great. So can you tell us a little bit more about that and, and I don't know how you've been working on it exactly. What it's going to do for these customers and yeah. How, how did you, how did you fully get to this process of where you're at?

So was it just that thinking? I need to find a way that we can actually. Closer guarantee the result for these customers or just seeing this as an extension to your business. Yeah. Any, anything else we can share about

Jorge Hernandez: that? Yeah. I mean, we have that, that high ticket service that is gonna, is gonna stay there for sure, because the target customer is different.

We are going for promoters, constructors builders. And for the online course, we are going for the team, for the agents and for the realtors that are managing the leads, we send them. So in the program, I, I wanted to make like like the seven years of experience, but compressed in, in two months, And in that way, they can transform their, their traditional business, eh, real estate business into a, a real, real estate digital agency.

So they don't even need to, to, to, to go to the office. They can work from home as, as we do. So Everything is start in, you know, defining their customer, what customer they wanna go, because it's not the same trying to find a buyer for a bill of $1 million than for an apartment of a hundred thousand.

So you have to be very clever defining that customer after defining that you have to, you know, set up the mindset that you are gonna have to to, to, to manage that. Also the sources and the digital marketing strategy, you are gonna build up to, to, to bring that customers. It's not the same, you know, you can find same investors and buyers in Facebook than in Instagram, than in linking, than in, you know, Google apps, for example.

So you have to be very clever and smart in the way of deciding which where is your customer as soon as you know, with which customer you want for your business, and then the way of proceeding and managing that lead in the CRM and how set up the states for that budget journey, and then how to close the deal, how to make your script.

And of course, They always forgotten lesson. That is the mindset, because if you don't have the proper mindset is like an interpreter. If you don't have the right mindset, you are fucked up. And I mean anything you are doing is nothing. You need your mindset and follow the, you know, the rules. So that's it.

That's that's the program. And, you know, I already prepare the funnels. I prepare the campaigns. I prepare the automations, the webinar. Everything is gonna be evergreen. and I think it's gonna be something huge because we have already 16,000 leads verified just to, you know, make the loans and to see the, the, the results.

Of course, I'm not gonna land to, I'm not gonna land to that 16,000. At the same time, we are gonna make like a little bit of a split testing and get improvement in, in the next weeks. And then we will see to, to make the big one. So that's it. .

Bryan McAnulty: Cool. Okay. So walk us through that. So if if a new creator's like watching this now and they say like, wow, okay.

So he built all this. He's gonna launch this giant course and he's has 16,000 leads. So they may be thinking, well, how did Jorge do this? So how, how long have you been working on this course? Like, of course. I understand it's the, it's the accumulation of all this knowledge that you've built in your digital marketing agency.

But how long has it take you taken you to, to build what you've built now? And like, have you always been getting those leads? Like, is that a recent thing? Have you been working on the leads along the same time as building the course? Like if someone was gonna do what you did, what would they be?

What would they be doing right now?

Jorge Hernandez: Okay. To be honest, we spent like, I mean, I spent like the last year creating the content, creating the lessons in Heights platform, creating all the educational material, like with the worksheets and with the videos and with the script and everything, just to make a really big.

Program. Okay. And before last year yeah, in 2019, I, I launched this book. Uh, it was a Amazon seller it's marketing in mobile area and is, is like real estate marketing in the digital era. And, and, you know, I got lot of, lot of leads from this book. And also during the process of getting customers for my high ticket service and also going to conferences, making online events and, you know, moving during, during for example, it was like six, seven years moving during the last seven years to make a brand, to, to let the world know myself.

And yeah. And getting a big database to, to try to, you know, make a nice land

Bryan McAnulty: launch. Okay. Well, I think, I think that's it. I think that answers it. That's the, the missing piece there, because, so you mentioned before we started recording with me that, that you saw one of my YouTube videos talking about how you have to get the course out there and launch it.

And you've been working on it quite a while, but but people shouldn't think that. Just because you were working on the course, you weren't just sitting there working on the course, you actually, before that you published this book and so you have built this audience along the way. So I think that's still, still good, even though you've taken maybe longer than you wish you did now to maybe launch the course I think that this is a, a good thing that you've built the audience and that's what the audience, our audience should realize.

If you're thinking about launching your own product, that you're, you're building up that, that audience along the way. So when you do launch the course, now you have all these leads. In your case, you have 16,000 leads to, to tell about this new product. Yeah, actually,

Jorge Hernandez: you know, one of the one of the, the Amazon, the Amazon reviews, the, you know, the testimonials in the.

One of the buyers say, yeah, yeah, the book, it it's it's Asan is great. He's uh, telling a lot of stuff, but I want to implement it. I need something to implement it. So give me more so that give me more is gonna be the master. It's gonna be the program. So, but for the creators that are watching us, I mean, you don't need to do so much stuff.

I did. And you, you don't need to spend so many years. I mean, it's my, my personal experience. And it is the way I did it, but I think you can go much faster if you have things clear and, and just make your, you know, what's your objective work, your target, what's your, the lifestyle you want. And, and if you are good in something, just show it to the world.

I mean, I was completely shut up for many, many, many, many, many, many years. I was like, Like a mouse working in the lab and nobody knows it. And, and it's a pity nowadays. It's a pity that nobody knows you, what you do and what the results you can get because people must know. I mean, is there way to help them?

Bryan McAnulty: Sure. Yeah. I mean, I think I can relate to that a little bit myself. Looking looking back a little bit. I feel similar that I wish I put out some more content earlier, not just to grow like an audience or whatever, but because I have all this that I've been learning and studying, but the purpose of it is you want to, to impact other people with that.

And so if you know all this, if you can do all this, but you're not helping people with it, then it's not actually that useful. So you want to, the, the reason that you and I are sitting here doing this interview today is because we got so sick of having all of these skills that we want to talk about it.

We have to talk about it with other people.

Jorge Hernandez: Yeah. I mean, I have the, the same feeling when you start the YouTube channel recently. And I don't now I think you have maybe 200 subscribers or something. But I, I saw you since the first video and in 30 videos you have now you make a lot of improvement and that, thanks.

Thanks a lot. That helps a lot because even though, you know, the content could be better or worse, but you are making your message, your way of communicating and, and letting, letting, letting people to know you. So. Yeah, we have to do that. I'm thinking about the YouTube channel for years, man. mm-hmm I didn't do it yet, but I hope with automations and all the evergreen webinar, I'm gonna have more time to make that.

But, you know, with the, the mouse lab thing I told you and that feeling in, I think it was in 2014. When I went back from France and I started living in aand, I felt like, okay, nobody knows me. And, and what I'm gonna do now, because I have to start again in Spain with the agency and okay, I'm gonna make a blog and start making block marketing dot else that it was, you know my personal branding thing at that moment.

And I create my first course. About that. I mean, my first course was actually the aria to market personnel block develop your personal branding with blog. And I didn't know anything about developing personal brand, but I read like lot of books making a lot of things. And at the end with experience of getting that block, marketing that as running, I make that course nowadays, you know, it was.

Lot of years ago, nowadays I have even am closer to 6,000 students. Uh, but what's the problem that the course is in NY. So, you know, you don't have the audience, you can communicate, communicate properly with your customers, with your students. Um for the beginning, it's quite okay. But in the long term, business is not, is not healthy.

So

Bryan McAnulty: yeah, you wanna have your own audience so you can communicate with them so you can not only serve them better, but so when you have a new product, you can promote that to them. And so that they're actually your customer that they can buy from you again, rather than being kind of ESE customer in that case.

Yeah.

Jorge Hernandez: Yeah. That was my first third thing with online courses in . But yeah, I'm going in the other way now.

Bryan McAnulty: that's great. So on this show, we like to ask all of our guests, if they have a question that they would ask the audience. So if you could ask anything of our audience members of creators right now, what would you want to know from them?

Yeah. You

Jorge Hernandez: know, my question is, do you have already set up your, a objective, your target in your life, in your lifestyle, in your business, in your professional career? If you don't have it, do it, do it now. because you are gonna save lot of time, lot of money, lot of energy doing that. It's really, it's really crazy that we spend a lot of time thinking about.

What car we are gonna buy or what house we are gonna buy, but then we don't plan anything about our future, our career and what, what we want in our life and what is lifestyle we want even. So that, that's my question.

Bryan McAnulty: Okay. So do you, do you have that? And then if you do then what is that then? I guess please.

Yeah, that would be great for them to share. Yeah. All right. Well, that's really great. I think that's all the questions that I have for you today, but before we get going, where can people find you online? Okay.

Jorge Hernandez: Uh, in the company website marketing in marketing, the marketing, the mobile area do com market.

Hey. Let me check , you know, we have like several website with the funnel and so on marketing, mobile.com. Okay. That's the, the official company. So that would be enough, I guess.

Bryan McAnulty: All right. Great. All right, well, thank you again, Jorge. Uh, for coming on the show, it was great talking with you.

Jorge Hernandez: Big pleasure mate.

Bryan McAnulty: If you enjoyed this interview and won the chance to ask questions to our guests live tune in on Tuesdays when new episodes premiere on the Heights platform, Facebook page, to learn more about the show and get notified when new episodes release, check out the creators, adventure.com until then keep learning and I'll see you in the next episode.